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Fwelin
Solar Supporter - Fought against the New Lunar Republic rebellion on the side of the Solar Deity (April Fools 2023).

@Darth Sonic  
Someone risking destabilizing a world because you can open up portals is not the same as being a planet buster, and doesn’t give a good idea of how much magic it requires at all.
 
It’s the difference between destroying a building because you destroyed a single essential support beam with a hammer and it collapsed, and destroying it utterly with a huge bomb. If the Equestria Girls dimension wasn’t connected to the MLP dimension, she would have been exactly zero danger to the planet itself.
 
@DAPLR  
Tirek finger-snapping to summon the mane six inside bubbles is pretty much classic Discord, especially since it was the first time he explicitly used visible magic without energy forming on his horns.
 
Also, given that he didn’t slow down nor start falling downwards, Tirek was probably flying when he smashed Twilight through the mountain.
Josh103
Thread Starter - Artists you miss.

@DAPLR  
But they would more than likely gain magic upon entering Equestria. Nothing proves that, but frankly even if they didn’t gain Equestrian magic Demon Sunset was still super powerful due to the corrupted Element of Magic and Demon Sunset could still possibly transform others into mini-demons.  
Well, if Discord can’t reality warp quickly enough he can still be defeated by powerful enough magic. Without question I think he would underestimate Demon Sunset’s threat which would be his undoing.
 
Speaking of Discord, I wonder what his limits are.
 
When Tirek sends the princesses to Tartarus (“Give my regards to Cerberus”) he opens one up and sends them through it. He didn’t have Discord’s power by that point, in fact not even the mane five’s, he was just that strong by that point. Celestia said that the pegasus powers to have flight and control the weather along with the earth pony power to tend the land will belong to him. So why didn’t he show it?
 
Tirek is one my favorite characters. Despite most people believing he is just a “dumb muscle” kind of character I don’t think so, especially with how Tirek is before he gets power. Very manipulative, and rolled with all the punches. Once he got power though, he never bothered with using the finer points of magic: he enjoys brute forcing his way to get what he wants, which is why he never bothers using the actual magic he acquires and only uses it to fuel his raw magical power. Even then he still kept a failsafe in Twilight’s friends if he couldn’t brute force his way to get Twilight’s alicorn magic. We did see some small subtle glimpses of the magic talent he got from absorbing, like when he snapped his fingers to make the mane five and Discord appear in the bubbles.
 
 
All in all Tirek is an underappreciated character imo.
DAPLR
Wallet After Summer Sale -
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@Josh103  
Maybe Demon Sunset’s thing would have gone well, maybe not. Sunset’s mind control, if it worked on the same principle as the Sirens, means it doesn’t work on ponies, only magicless humans. She would have the EQG world at her disposal, which is likely a lot, but not Equestrian citizens.  
Also, how would she deal with Discord’s reality bending powers?
 
I think Daydream Shimmer, as one who can close these dimensional rifts, would be a good counter to the chaotic magic Midnight and Discord use.
 
One last thing. When did Tirek demonstrate dimensional magic? Despite draining the ponies magic, he doesn’t seem to take their characteristics with it. No flying from the Pegasus, no teleportation from the Princess’, he seems to just drain their magic as a fundamental energy and add it to his own. With Discord, this would mean he gets a huge magic boost, but not reality bending powers.
Josh103
Thread Starter - Artists you miss.

@DAPLR  
@Darth Sonic
 
While I love power and battle discussions, a significant problem I’ve had with this franchise in general is that they never set the rules, so to speak, of how power and magic work. They briefly touch upon it in Feeling Pinkie Keen I think but the show has evolved far beyond the simplistic explanations it offered imo.
 
It’s hard to gauge Daydream’s and Midnight’s power particularly compared to their potential power in Equestria. Dimensional rifts are very powerful in general, and only Tirek, Discord and Midnight have demonstrated it (Daydream merely closed the rifts, we can’t assume she can also open them). So far most would agree these are the most powerful villains/characters in the series, no?
 
People like to joke that Sunset in her demon form’s plan to invade Equestria would’ve failed easily. But it’s my personal belief she was actually pretty much invincible… the Element of Magic itself was powering her. If only she didn’t attack Twilight, I believe she would’ve pretty easily conquered Equestria , Discord included.
Darth Sonic
Friendship, Art, and Magic (2019) - Celebrated Derpibooru's seventh year anniversary with friends.
Friendship, Art, and Magic (2018) - Celebrated Derpibooru's six year anniversary with friends.

@Josh103  
Swore Midnight said something that suggested that this would be easy task…
 
Oh well, Freindship Games is not a frequent watch for me, so I guess I remembered things wrong. Still, she and Sunset are the only ones ever suggested to be at that level regardless, with the possible exception of Giant Tirek (we never actually see what he can do).
DAPLR
Wallet After Summer Sale -
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@Josh103  
What I gathered from Midnight Sparkle’s ability was that since she absorbed the portal’s power too, it gave her the ability to replicate its effects, though on a bigger and more unstable scale, so she can make portals.
 
A question arises. Is Equestria Girls in another universe, or in the same universe as regular MLP? It’s the difference between creating interdimensional portal’s and wormholes.
 
Can I just say that these kind of conversations are my favourite? I love exploring and thinking about implications and possibilities of characters powers, so this is a lot of fun :D
Josh103
Thread Starter - Artists you miss.

@Darth Sonic  
Midnight was causing localized dimensional rifts. Only line that suggests it could be planet threatening is Sunset’s “you’re destroying this world to get it!”
 
They’re far from planet busters, which can easily bust a planet. Midnight could potentially threaten the planet but she can’t destroy it easily or quickly. I saw no planet busting here.
Darth Sonic
Friendship, Art, and Magic (2019) - Celebrated Derpibooru's seventh year anniversary with friends.
Friendship, Art, and Magic (2018) - Celebrated Derpibooru's six year anniversary with friends.

@Background Pony #AD87  
Except she already kinda did? I don’t remember the exact line, but I believe Midnight Sparkle said she would ultimately destroy the planet Equestria is on in the process of studying it. Daydream Shimmer held her own against Midnight. This makes both characters, to use Versus debate terminology, Planet-Busters. That puts them in at least Saiyan Saga Vegeta’s power range, far beyond anything seen in the main show.
 
Admittedly, Sci-Twi also got this power boost, but Sci-Twi ain’t the main character of FiM, is she?
Background Pony #5B50
There’s is literally zero chance that the writers are ever going to have anyone, let alone a movie-only character, upstage the main character in such a fundamental way.
 
I’d put my money on Starlight, no matter what inexplicabilities that ever happening to her might raise. But only as long as Haber is in charge of things.
Background Pony #6CA2
@CronoM  
Man, your fanboying for Sunset is incredible, and the sheer distances you reach to justify said fanboying is similarly impressive.
 
There’s is literally zero chance that the writers are ever going to have anyone, let alone a movie-only character, upstage the main character in such a fundamental way.
Background Pony #54AB
@CronoM  
@DAPLR  
Interesting theory. However, as much as I like Sunset and your positive interpretation of her, I wouldn’t want her to go so far as to become any ultra special “all-your-powers-combined” or “the-only-capable-problem-solver-around” type of character. It’s just that seeing how they’ve handled (and tried to justify) The Princess of Friendship or Glimmer being something close to such a character doesn’t exactly fill me with confidence. I don’t think substituting the previous holder of that title with a character that essentially tries to fill the same role would be the right call to make, as opposed to fixing the original problem that made their writing appear incredulous to some people in the first place.
 
I think the transformation at the end of FG instead of the rainbow attack that we’re used to seeing was because of the amulet she (and Twilight) used to absorb the magic.
 
I guess in time we will see what the writers decide to do with her, if they ever decide to explicitly explain just how Sunset factors into the whole Elements of Harmony dynamic (if she is even part of it or something all together different) or just name drop what most people so far have asumed to be her element. We can definitely be sure that she is important in some way.
DAPLR
Wallet After Summer Sale -
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@CronoM  
I agreed that Sunset changed the final attack in Rainbow Rocks, she added to it. I didn’t agree that her element did that. I had never given thought to how the Avatar of Friendship WASN’T a rainbow, so I figured I’d say so. That attack WAS Gaugable as more powerful than the usual rainbow attack.
 
It was never implied Sunset’s magic got drained there. She was there to show that the portal got drained when it activated. (Also, it helped remove a plot hole of, ‘Why didn’t Sunset go to Equestria for help?’)  
Add to this that Sunset wasn’t drained or fatigued in any way afterwards, unlike the others who, post magic drain, were.
 
The elements clearly don’t have masters, and seem to switch as the situation requires. Luna and Celestia, Celestia herself, the Mane 6, (possibly) the Humane 5 and Twilight, then back to the Mane 6. If Sunset needed to be the 6th element, and she has the personality and power for it, then it gave it to her when she called for it.
 
The five elements combined don’t make the sixth, which then is friendship. There has to BE six. In Friendship Games, Sunset had the 5, but with Twilight not in the co operative mood, needed to be the missing link, Magic. You need six, Honesty, Kindness, Laughter, Loyalty, Generosity (Humane 5) and Magic. At the time, only Sunset could fulfill that role so she did.
 
As for her transformation, it is admittedly unclear as to why that happened even considering both our arguments. Could be instead of launching an attack, the magic decided to manifest itself within Sunset and give her it’s power rather than explode out as a rainbow.
CronoM

@DAPLR  
“Twilight absorbed the other 5 and the portal’s energy, I don’t think she ever took Sunset’s since Sunset never ponied up in that movie. Also, the theme of the movie was that Sunset was fulfilling the role of Twilight, learning what she had learnt. She gave nearly the same speech, with the conclusions being, (possibly out of order in memory) ’Honesty, Kindness, Generosity, Loyalty, Laughter….I’m going to show you the most powerful magic of all. The magic of Friendship.’  
Considering that friendship is the culmination of the six elements, I think it’s fair to guess that she was acting as the element of Magic at the time.”
 
Odd, you just agreed in Rainbow Rocks that Sunset’s other element changed it.
 
The portal’s energy and Sunset’s energy were quite linked, the only reason it absorbed the portal that time was because Sunset was touching it. They did make the scene show the portal getting drained ‘through’ her.
 
If we were going by ‘theme’, which is not a solid argument, the Element of Magic would take the 5’s magic into itself without asking like in MMC. Instead, she received the powers willingly and became an angelic being way more powerful then the humanized alicorn we’ve seen Twilight become in the human world several times. Its safe to assume that she is referring to the element more powerful then the element of magic. Magic is not THE element of friendship, its the spark of friendship, they established that a great while back. It only makes sense that Twilight’s destiny was to reform Sunset who had the greatest element.
DAPLR
Wallet After Summer Sale -
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@CronoM  
Rainbow Rocks;  
You’re right. Usually when the six combine they make a rainbow attack, but adding Sunset changed it and, very likely, made it more powerful. And since the Mane Six combined attack is the most powerful in the show (beats Tirek who had all pony magic in the world), this would have made the Avatar of Friendship the most powerful attack at the time :D
 
Friendship Games;  
Twilight absorbed the other 5 and the portal’s energy, I don’t think she ever took Sunset’s since Sunset never ponied up in that movie. Also, the theme of the movie was that Sunset was fulfilling the role of Twilight, learning what she had learnt. She gave nearly the same speech, with the conclusions being, (possibly out of order in memory) ‘Honesty, Kindness, Generosity, Loyalty, Laughter….I’m going to show you the most powerful magic of all. The magic of Friendship.’  
Considering that friendship is the culmination of the six elements, I think it’s fair to guess that she was acting as the element of Magic at the time.
 
SPOILERTASTIC;  
|| Wow, I can’t wait to watch this movie! I didn’t really look into it at all, and was worried that it would be a nothing film, but it sounds like it expands the characters and lore in EXCELLENT ways. Now then. Sunset’s element doesn’t have a name? I almost want to ask why her element would just be what the other six make up, again.  
Still, this Harmony ability sounds SUPER interesting.||
CronoM

@DAPLR  
In regards to Rainbow Rocks?
 
All 6 of them were in Rainbow Power form at the beginning of their fight. When Sunset ponied up and all 7 united their energies, the 6 elements of harmony came out to fire a rainbow power harmony blaster, but then the 7th one came out of Sunset and formed something on an entirely different level.
 
In regards to Friendship Games?
 
All evidence is against Sunset being the element of magic. Midnight Sparkle absorbed some of all 5 elements and a little of Sunset’s, which overwhelmed Twilight and possibly merged with her own latent abilities. Daydream Shimmer was using the 5 elements matched with her own. Nothing mentioned or suggested Sunset’s power was the Element of Magic. In fact it seems to be the exact opposite type of power.
 
@DAPLR  
||Human Twilight is confirmed to be the Element of Magic. Sunset’s discovered her awakened Harmony ability is to see into the hearts and minds of others, which is essentially the most passive and most powerful friendship ability in existence. Its theorized that whatever name they give for it, Sunset’s the element of friendship, and since friendship is magic but magic is always friendship, it makes sense that this element is ultimately stronger then the element of magic.  
>>989094 ||
DAPLR
Wallet After Summer Sale -
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@Chuy-kun  
Haven’t read the book, but in combination with the other comments, it sounds like Sunset will have some sort of Ultimate Power.
 
“MY MAGIC IS THE MAGIC THAT CREATES THE HEAVENS!!!!”
DAPLR
Wallet After Summer Sale -
Not a Llama - Happy April Fools Day!

@CronoM
 
You mean Rainbow Rocks? With The Avatar of Friendship? Because while it did beat the sirens, it’s hard to gauge where there power is in comparison to, say, Tirek.
 
Or do you mean Friendship Games?
 
Wasn’t she just being the sixth element,as the Element of Magic, when combining the other five elements?
 
And hey, I like Sunset and her incredible power as much as the next Sunset fan, but it’s hard to gauge her power in that form. She can fix tears in reality (or are they just wormholes?),
CronoM

@DAPLR  
Nah man, we are referring to when her unique element of harmony merged with the other 6’s to summon god tier friendship magic. Magic way more powerful then anything we’ve seen in the show.