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the new comic of “*THE NIGHTMARE NIGHT CHRONICLES” final is reseald >>2183544
The chaotic world he would have created would be no worse then having the trio in charge. It would be practically a nightmare with ponies as his personal playthings. At least with the trio, they did not intend to summon the windigos and were planning on taking them out.
How was Discord any worse than what those three did?
Same, not even Discord deserved this.
She may, or may not be aware of it happening. Plus, honestly this is just a gag pic.
you do realize that will only make Chryssi’s view of ponies WORSE right?
Well at least SOMEONE has an explanation for her rejecting reformation in a way that actually makes sense… I mean at the very least she needs Iroh’s pride talk he had with zuko from avatar(and a cup of tea) “pride is not the opposite of shame but its source”
Edited
You would be surprised at my preferences… You seem to think all people judge based on looks and past actions… I know this seems retarded to you “she cannot be reformed” troglodytes, but i KNOW there must be some good in her and perhaps a little freely given love would help her understand that not all ponies want to hurt her. I would be one of the few to give love to her… I know she rejected both offers for reformation but right before both she genuinely considered accepting for a few seconds… I mean that alone should be confirmation that she has the capacity to reform but lets her pain get in the way which is not unreasonable given any examples of her interacting with ponies has brought her much pain so she now sees THEM as monsters as much as the ponies see her as a monster.
You know maybe if the ponies had not alienated chrysalis in the first place and had instead welcomed her the first time she met ponies then maybe there wouldn’t be any animosity between her and equestria and she wouldn’t be in stone right now… I know my point of view is not a popular one and hey maybe I’m as crazy as people say(sure i am, what’s your point?) Or maybe its my own craving for intimacy and desire to give my love to someone, and knowing that my best chances would be with a being who needs love to survive(hell its not like i was using my love for much of anything anyways) when i think of it chryssi and i have similar core motives that would fit each other perfectly, she desires love so she can have sustenance, and i desire the sweet feeling of giving my love to someone and actually amounting to something by doing something that matters
That does seem to be the case. I’d say you summed it up rather well.
Is there any shame in me thinking that we’ve pretty much gotten done with this conversation? Got some of what we wanted, in that we (or at least I) understand different views a bit?
I would say I’m largely in agreement with your take on Chrysalis’ songs, though I generally default to the Adaptation Hypothesis. My thinking is that even if a song exists in-universe, it isn’t being performed exactly as portrayed. For instance, Winter Wrap Up is a song that probably exists in-universe in some form, but the spontaneous performance of it probably didn’t occur and the version we heard is likely a variation, combining the in-universe song’s lyrics with personal additions from individual characters and a few purely Adaptational lines from Twilight.
I’m afraid I don’t really see it. Outside of the phrase “a better way to be bad” and the references to their existing malicious intentions, I find that the song doesn’t really touch on how they view themselves.
Before anything else, I’d like to point out that I don’t generally take the events of The Ending of the End as being indicative of the general character of the Legion of Doom’s members. I’ve discussed at least one of the reasons for this before. In any case, I don’t think it should be assumed that Cozy can speak for Chrysalis and Tirek, even if she does see herself as a villain.
With that out of the way, I’d like to take this opportunity to vent a bit. To be frank, I really don’t like that line. Card-Carrying Villainy is a trope this series usually steers clear of, which I would say is to its credit. That isn’t to say there’s no place for it, but I really don’t think it fits here. I think it makes the world less believable when there are self-described villains in it. This applies to selfish villains as well, since even they would regard themselves as the protagonists, though not necessarily heroes, of their own story. On the whole, this is one of several issues I have with the way the villains are written in that two-parter.
True enough, I suppose. Still, I think it would’ve been a rewarding development to see.
Well, regarding Chrysalis and her songs, I think with This Day Aria, her half was “All in Her Head” (otherwise she would’ve been caught, lol), and it was 100% happening during her reprise (Cadance gets the Adaptation variant for her portion).
Regarding A Better Way to Be Bad though, their argument directly after the song was this:
Implying that that song might’ve been a case of it actually happening.
But in any case, songs like that tend to represent the mindset of the characters rather accurately, and if it’s anything to go by, they’re all Card-Carrying Villains, and it’s in the dark sense of that trope, because they don’t have to morally justify themselves to be the heroes in their own mind, which gives them free reign to be unrestrained.
At the very least, Cozy Glow sees herself and the others as evil, and the other two seemed to feel no desire to correct her.
Pride defines Chrysalis indeed. It’s one of the most appreciable things about her, along with determination. If she reformed, she’d be swallowing it.
(Hopefully that talk about songs in-universe was a bit interesting, on account of being unconventional)
Edited
@AC97
I tend to think it fits better into the Adaptational Hypothesis, with the argument serving as a transition back to the more literal portrayal of events.
Pride, I suspect. If she were to mend her ways, it would mean admitting that she was wrong and that the ones who opposed, thwarted and deposed her were right. Being the proud mare she is, she would doubtless consider that a defeat.
There are other possible reasons I could suggest, but I think pride is the most obvious.
I must say that even though we disagree, you are being far more reasonable about this then some which resort to petty insults or ask questions like “would you forgive Hitler?”
But yes, this only works in the magical world of friendship and attempting to change someone in the real world would just make you miserable for the rest of your life.
Edited
If she had an actual desire to be good… why did she actively reject the thought of becoming better in Frenemies? It would’ve cost her nothing.
There comes a certain point when you realize that whether it’s a 0.001% or 0% chance of working, you can’t help those who don’t want to help themselves, so you have to give up on them at some point, for your sake.
This logic is very applicable in the real world, by the way (I’m not necessarily talking about villains like Chrysalis here, and I’m hoping the situations involved are less extreme). People have and will persistently refuse to get proper help for their mental illnesses, and even if it’s family, nobody should have to deal with the kind of persistent stress involved. Trust me, I know what some of it is like, and nothing about that is fun.
That can also be said about things like drug addicts, abusers, and the like, when they’re persistently hurting others around them, with their actions. They won’t get help/stop with their course of action? Sometimes just giving up on them is the only sensible option left.
Edited
Well, Chrysalis acts as a tough villain but we know the desire to do good and be loved (for reasons beyond power) exists inside and she buries it down. To quote a popular movie series…
“There’s still good in [her]”
The same goes for the other two. From an objective standpoint, they all seem to see themselves as evil, and are perfectly okay with it. They really did sing that song, judging from how their argument over the song immediately after clearly factored into “Grogar” being frustrated with them.
Edited
(Eh, don’t sweat the use of “statement,” lol. Your vocabulary ain’t bad, it seems)
In short, with the way I see Chrysalis, she is a narcissist, and a trait strongly associated with those?
They see others as an extension of their ego. So when Chrysalis says the words “we” and “us,” in my eyes, she’s conceptualizing her hive as an extension of her, their desires equaling her own, and who cares how they think.
I probably should’ve clarified this a long time ago.
You might disagree on her being a narcissist, but she undeniably shares a lot of traits associated with them.
Trixie, in my eyes, is also narcissistic, but she’s notably less severe of a case.
While she certainly brought up power, it’s quite clear that she isn’t referring to personal power, but the strength changelings gain by consuming love. It’s also worth noting that she uses “we” and “my fellow changelings” rather than “me” and “I”.
Further, I believe the principal statement for determining her motive would be “as queen of the changelings, it is up to me to find food for my subjects.”, as it directly addresses the purpose of her invasion. Given the context of the statement, I see no reason to assume she’s being dishonest, nor do I see what other purpose the statement could serve.
I don’t really see why she would need to. Cadance’s statement was just a factual description of how changelings operate.
I must confess, the first part of this statement is confounding me. It leads me to believe that I may have misinterpreted your earlier statement. If this is case, it will prove difficult to expand upon my own question. As I do not wish to further confuse matters, I shall withhold comment on the subject.
As to the second, while I don’t believe it is her primary motive, it’s quite clear that she does take pleasure in conquest. However, I’m afraid I don’t really see the connection. Starving or not, I don’t see why she couldn’t contrive a new reason for waging war if she really wanted to. There are plenty of potential pretexts that do not involve the changelings’ perpetual hunger.
Reading this over, I’m starting to think I may use the word “statement” too much.
And Twilight has plenty of opportunities to turn Garble to stone everytime he assaulted her or her friends but didn’t.
Edited
So did Starlight, Discord and Luna (and technically Tempest).
@AC97
I’d feel bad for them no matter what race they were, noone deserves this.