Sonic Discussion

Beau Skunky
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@Nightweaver20xx  
Well, he’s been having the younger Eiji Aonuma direct the recent Zelda games, and new developers have been making stuff like Splatoon.  
Besides, just ‘cause somebody’s old/young doesn’t mean they can’t come up with new fresh ideas. “Super Mario Odyssey” seems more unique & unorthodox compared to most other Super Mario games, and it was not just made by Miyamoto, but other developers too.
 
If anything, Sonic Team is probably the ones who need more new developers. Sega needs all the help they can get at this point. (Though, buying Atlus seems to of benefited them.)
Background Pony #ADC0
At this point, Sega needs to put the Sonic franchise on hiatus (a brief one, maybe 3 or 4 years at most) and try and figure out what to do going forward. Take a few years off and plan things out a bit.
 
Also since Shigeru Miyamoto possibly needing to retire has been brought up, I now want to go on a tirade about how he ruined Paper Mario, but that would be really going off-topic.
Beau Skunky
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@BrownieComicWriter  
I guess that goes to show “new” doesn’t always mean better.
 
@Shadow the Hedgehog  
Sadly, Sega’s been doing that sense the ‘90s. Sonic 3 was actually rushed, in fact, due to rushing it, (and technical limitations) they had to split the game into 2 games that could connect together. Sonic 3, and S&K.  
This is why “Sonic 3 & Knuckles” is considered the true version.
 
@Background Pony #40B1  
To be fair, ||”Sticker Star’s” changes, and simpler story wasn’t just Miyamoto’s idea, but the PM producer’s, as well, due to the lack of feedback on “Super Paper Mario’s” storyline from fans in the “Club Nintendo” surveys for the game. (Because of that, they assumed, players didn’t care for the story much.) Not to mention, Miyamoto is hardly even involved in the RPG Paper Mario titles, and he is allowing more story in them after fans got upset over the 3DS game. Him “retiring” doesn’t mean his games would “improve.” ||
Jarkes
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@Beau Skunky
 
It WAS Miyamoto who forced the Paper Mario producers to heavily rework Sticker Star because he said it was “too much like the Gamecube game.” Even though that was the whole POINT of making it an RPG again.
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@Beau Skunky  
My problem with Sticker Star is that the game was still trying to be an RPG… but Miyamoto basically mandated that everything important to an RPG (deep and compelling story, a well-developed cast of main characters, interesting side characters, and a proper battle system with experience points) be stripped from it, resulting in a game that has no idea what it’s trying to be. I wouldn’t have disliked the game as much if they just made it a basic 3D platformer like Super Mario 3D World instead of trying to keep it an RPG. I haven’t played Color Splash, but from what I’ve heard it’s basically the same thing as Sticker Star, but with more attempts at humor… and it’s probably gonna be that way for a while, since I remember them saying that Sticker Star’s gonna be the template for the series going forward.
 
For the record, I actually generally like Shigeru Miyamoto and greatly respect him and what he’s done for Nintendo and the gaming industry as a whole. However, I’m not touching another Paper Mario game again until we get a proper RPG game that at least tries to be as good as, if not better than, The Thousand-Year Door (which I consider to be one of the greatest RPG games ever made, at least for a Nintendo console).

 
@Jarkes  
That particularly stung for me, as someone who absolutely adores The Thousand-Year Door. I get not wanting to rehash that game, but taking an RPG game and trying to distance it from the genre as much as possible while still trying to keep it an RPG is not a good idea no matter how you slice it.
 
… this is really going off-topic now. Can we move this to the Video Game general thread?
Jarkes
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@Background Pony #40B1
 
Color Splash is actually a lot better than Sticker Star and fixes a lot of the problems Sticker Star had. It even has a level-up system of sorts even if it’s not truly experience points.
 
But yes, we’re getting off-topic.
Jarkes
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Remember when Iizuka said shortly after Generations came out that the “Classic and Modern together” gameplay of Generations was going to be a one-time thing?
 
Boy, THAT statement sure didn’t age well…
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@Jarkes  
I also heard that Iizuka is convinced Green Hill Zone is so integral to the Sonic experience that we need it in every game. (Because having it reappear in Generations AND Mania wasn’t enough.)
 
And by the look of it, Chemical Plant Zone is following suit.
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And by the look of it, Chemical Plant Zone is following suit.
 
Sonic 2 had way more iconic zones in it. Casino Night, Mystic Cave, Oil Ocean, etc. And Starlight Zone from S1 had way better music than GHZ so by that reason alone it should appear more.
Jarkes
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Saw one guy on Twitter posit that Green Hill was the only Zone in Sonic 1 that actually got the speed and momentum the game was going for, given how every Zone after that is much slower-paced, and it took them a while to really capture the same level of speed that Green Hill had again.
Jarkes
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@LightningBolt
 
Oh right, now I remember what he actually said. He said that it took the first game until Starlight Zone to get the speed right again.
 
I’d link to the tweet, but… well, he blocked me because I said something stupid and it pissed him off.
Beau Skunky
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To be honest, I’m not too bothered by GHZ’s reappearances, because as Jarkes said having a similar GHZ-like level in every Sonic game has been pretty normal in the series. (Emerald Hill Zone, Green Grove Zone, Mushroom Hill Zoon, Seaside Hill Zone, ect.)  
Still, I suppose they are going overboard using the exact classic GHZ, as opposed to making GHZ-like beginning stages. That might make some player’s grow tired of it, or feel they’re relying too much on nostalgia, and might actually ruin fans’ love of the classic level.
 
Emerald Coast of “Sonic Adventure” was a good example of a brand new beginning stage that was new, but still has a classic GHZ-ish vibe without being exactly like GHZ. The beach theme, the water guard-railing the level, the springs, the running up the wall, rocking wooden dock bridges, the orca whale chase, it had alot of cool features you couldn’t do in GHZ. It’s actually still one of my favorite 3D levels.
 
Windy Hill Zone of “Sonic Lost World” was actually pretty good too, I felt. Had the GHZ vibe a bit stronger, but still had some unique things about it. Was even used in SSB, and was arguably a better SSB stage then Brawl’s GHZ.
Jarkes
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@Beau Skunky
 
I loved the joke in the Lost World prequel comic where Cubot’s like, “Doesn’t this place seem familiar?” And Orbot responds, “Nope, this is totally original terrain.”
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I’m gonna downvote ProJared’s Worst Games of 2017 video (when it comes out) if Sonic Forces is on it.
 
@Beau Skunky  
Well, I hope those fans are fucking happy. Super Paper Mario was more fun than Sticker Star could ever be.
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