Well not everyone is the same friend you’ll find assholes in every group on the internet and to be fair people say the same about bronies but I’m sure we both know that’s not entirely true were not all assholes just some of us, it’s not nice being overzealous no matter who is doing it.

@Creepermin3  
really? I think it’s the other way around; the majority of the Sunset fanbase tends to harp on those who even dare express their dislike for her (even if it’s in a civilized manner). and she’s forced unto others, which only makes matters worse. :/

THAT SMUG EXPRESSION!!! HNNGGG! I’m just so ADDICTED to it! :D

Sunset Shimmer is my favorite character in the series, that’s my opinion, if you don’t like her I respect your opinion. I’m saying this because I’m really sick of people treating there opinions like fact and acting like all in existence will explode if Sunset isn’t a universally disliked character, some people like Sunset shimmer, some people don’t, if you don’t like it then you’ll have to deal with it cuz that’s real life for ya.

@D50  
“I am perfect!”

@Spinny  
People have been saying Sunny is “perfect” for a long time. As a compliment. Because she is perfect.

@Background Pony #0A4D  
Seconded.

@DiscipleOfAndrewRyan  
Screw you.

@Spinny  

@Spinny  

All of a sudden, I keep seeing people using the words “perfect” and “Mary Sue” to describe Sunset. And all I can say to that is: Where the hell have you guys been?
 
This is what led you to this conclusion? Not the fact that she lacks flaws, that she does no wrong, that there isn’t a single, solitary negative quality to be found about her character, or that she’s been pulling new talents and skills out of thin air ever since the revelation that she plays guitar in Rainbow Rocks?
 
Sunset has been perfect for a very long time now. Wouldn’t go as far as to call her a Mary Sue, but she is unquestionably perfect. And clearly, she’s only getting more perfect. If you honestly think this is the last time she’s going to gain a new talent…yeah, I’ll just remind you that it was merely about 2-3 months ago that we learned that she’s an artist, and about a week or so ago that we learned that she’s a gamer.
 
Of course, it’s up to you whether you consider her perfection to be a good thing or a bad thing. But I’d say it’s about time you finally caught on.

@Background Pony #CD1E  
Not for nothing, but the fact that you said anything at all means that we’ve already succeeded in forcing you to waste your time & energy on us.

People arguing about technicalities and shit, you know full well what we mean, language is an abstract concept. There was a time when gay meant happy. You should be focusing on the intention, babbling on and on about a word but not the intention is just stupid, and no, if you respond to me with a big ass paragraph I’m not replying to it, because then you have succeeded in forcing me to waste my time and energy on you.

@D50  
You forgot to properly define the “historical” definition.

@OneOverTwo  
The definition of Mary Sue is thoroughly documented. Casual vocabulary allows for minor concessions where a character can be considered a Mary Sue with exceptions like being introduced in canon or having “blemishes” (to say that they’re not PERFECT at EVERYTHING, but it’s usually something inconsequential or endearing like not being able to cook well).
 
Just being exceptionally skilled does not a Sue make, nor does having the spotlight or being in-universe charismatic. Where the line that separates the Mary Sue from the merely exceptional lies is that area of subjectivity you’re talking about, and there’s no way nor any reason to “solve” it. People can debate whether an example is definitively a Mary Sue or not by arguing where that line should be placed, or they can move past it and move on to the more important question of “do these qualities make the character in question a poorly written character?” Because that’s really what it boils down to nowadays.
 
In a nutshell, I subscribe to three definitions: the historical definition that more strictly defines a fanfiction archetype, the casual definition that basically means “a fictional character that shares most, if not all of the characteristics of the historical Mary Sue,” and the slang definition that often describes NOT a Mary Sue, but a similar situation that overlaps in characteristics, like the Creator’s Pet or the Spotlight Stealer.

@D50  
I mean the only other close to catch-all definition I can think of for “Mary Sue” is “The story centers around them for no real reason.” Maybe a bit too vague, but still.  
_{Which still makes it so that a character’s amount of skills doesn’t actually need to be a factor, eh.}
 
Is that (or a slight modification of that) a “good enough” definition for the term?  
_{Also one of the common problems with using the term “Mary Sue” is that it has seemingly practically lost any meaningful definition…}
 
Basically I was saying that the term maybe doesn’t retain any meaningful definition? *shrug*
 
Maybe you should tell me how you define the term “Mary Sue” so that I see what you think it means, exactly.

@OneOverTwo  
No, it’s still circular. As evidence, one only has to take into account a typical statement and subsequent potential exchange:
 
“I don’t like this character because she’s a Mary Sue.”  
“What about her makes her a Mary Sue?”  
“Well, I don’t like her, and that makes her a Mary Sue.”
 
That Mary Sues are hated is a characteristic of them, but logically that cannot be a defining characteristic if the term is to maintain any meaningful definition. That there is some subjectivity to the term is inescapable, but opening the definition up like that exponentially magnifies the problem.

@D50  
It’s not “people have a problem with mary sues… because they have a problem with them.” It’s “People having a problem with them is what designates them as Mary Sues in the first place.”
 
I’m not saying people hate Mary Sues because people hate Mary Sues, I’m saying people hating a character is an important aspect of what gets them defined as a Sue.
 
_{The definition of a Mary Sue kind of has to be somewhat opinion based since it’s now often used in reference to things other than fan fiction, neh…}

@OneOverTwo  
People have a problem with mary sues… because they have a problem with them. Either you seriously misunderstood me or you don’t quite get how circular that reasoning is.

Sunset confirmed ghetto artist.

@D50  
How is it not, though? That’s the main reason people have a problem with Mary Sue type characters in the first place.
 
What criteria is a better practical measure than that?  
_{Even when it’s fairly obvious that a character is a Mary Sue, it’s still technically a designation determined by opinion.}
 
I am legitimately asking these questions.

@OneOverTwo  
No, the typical reaction to Mary Sues is not in any way a defining characteristic of them.

humn.. she is very tomboyish in this series…

@marik_azemus34  

 

@marik_azemus34  
I like that.